Missy Mastel (00:00):

what I’d like to introduce right now, maybe, is this idea of women as impact investors. And I will say they are the best impact investors there are. They are people who understand what a collective community can do. The power of being in community, being together and doing things together, and the power of the individual to spark the right flames.

[Music playing]

Stephanie McCullough (00:31):

Hey, dear listeners, we need to let you know that Kevin and Stephanie offer investment advice through Private Advisor Group, which is a federally registered investment advisor. The opinions voiced in this podcast are for general information only and are not intended to provide specific advice or recommendations to any individual. To determine which strategies or investments may be suitable for you. Consult the appropriate qualified professional prior to making a decision. Now, let’s get on with the show.

Stephanie McCullough (01:06):

This is Take Back Retirement, the show that’s redefining retirement for women. Retirement is an old-fashioned cultural concept. We want to reclaim the word so you can make it your own. I’m Stephanie McCullough, financial planner and founder of Sofia Financial, where our mission is to reduce women’s money stress and empower them to make wise holistic decisions so they can get back to living their best lives.

Kevin Gaines is my longtime colleague with deep knowledge in the technical stuff: investments, taxes, retirement plan rules. He’s a little bit nerdy and quantitative, I’m a little bit touchy-feely and qualitative. Together, through conversations and interviews, we aim to give you the information and motivation you need to move forward with confidence. We’re so glad you’re here.

 Stephanie McCullough (01:55):

Coming to you semi-live from the beautiful Westlakes office park in suburban Philadelphia, this is Stephanie McCullough and Kevin Gaines of Sofia Financial and American Financial Management Group. Say hello, Kevin.

Kevin Gaines (01:06):

Hello, Kevin.

Stephanie McCullough (02:08):

Today, we are talking with Missy Sue Mastel. She is a prominent financial strategist and transformational leader with over 30 years of nonprofit capacity-building experience.

Stephanie McCullough (02:19):

She has degrees in accounting, international business, sustainability, and theology from Georgetown and Oxford. Missy charts her audiences and clients on a path towards ethical change that we need to make in the world without sacrificing best-in-class financial growth.

Stephanie McCullough (02:35):

She is a frequent speaker with TEDx Talks and university lectures. Missy’s goal is to inspire future leaders and drive transformational organizational change worldwide.

[Music playing]

Stephanie McCullough (02:45):

Let’s dive in to our conversation with Missy.

Stephanie McCullough (02:54):

Missy Mastel, welcome to Take Back Retirement.

Missy Mastel (02:57):

Thank you so much, Stephanie. I’m so excited and delighted to be here.

Stephanie McCullough (03:02):

Yeah. So, let’s start with this. Tell us, Missy, what you’re doing these days, and how you came to be doing it.

Missy Mastel (03:08):

Well, first of all, I just want to say I am so excited to be speaking with people who are talking to people (in particular women) and organizations and things that may feel not so confident or comfortable managing their money.

Missy Mastel (03:28):

And I’m applauding your audience as well for seeking out some good resources and some help to get into a better frame of mind about how other people are doing things and how we succeed even as we are looking to retire and are looking to move into other stages of our lives.

Missy Mastel (03:47):

So, this is a wonderful organization. Great that you’re doing this. Thank you so much for bringing this forward. It’s so important.

Missy Mastel (03:54):

And I think particularly for women, we have a lot of hangups about money and a lot of hangups about what it means to be wealthy, and what wealthy can look like. And I think it’s really important to have great conversations about these things. So, thank you so much.

Stephanie McCullough (04:15):

Absolutely, yeah.

Missy Mastel (04:16):

So, what I’m doing right now is actually sort of a … I can’t even describe how on point it feels for me because for years I’ve been working with nonprofit organizations, which is a really (to me) important part of legacy building.

Missy Mastel (04:34):

And for 30 years, I’ve advised nonprofits in doing capacity building. How to be more than — how to think more of themselves than society might think of them, which is a nice tie-in to people who need to learn more about money and how they can be more than they have thought of themselves before.

Missy Mastel (04:57):

But recently, I started to take classes in sustainability. About two years ago, I started to take classes in sustainability. And I realized that the world is just not doing as well as we think it is.

Missy Mastel (05:11):

Even when we have financial wealth and what I call “hypergrowth capitalism,” I think is the term of the trade, people are making money hand over fist, but we’re doing it at such a … we’re plundering resources to do it.

Missy Mastel (05:29):

And we have a lot of people who think that that’s okay and that balance can stick. But that balance doesn’t stick very well. So, what I’ve been doing recently is taking all that I’ve learned with nonprofits and trying to apply it to that sustainability problem.

Missy Mastel (05:44):

So, if you’re a woman or you’re a mom and you’re thinking about what the future is going to look like for you and for your children and for your grandchildren, we have to start thinking about the resources that we’re using and the way that we’re using them.

Missy Mastel (06:02):

The interesting thing about nonprofits and people who have been financially overlooked, is that they have more power than they think they do.

 

Stephanie McCullough (06:14):

Ooh, say more.

Missy Mastel (06:15):

Yeah. So, what I’ve been working on is matching up organizations that actually do make a difference in the world with the people and the corporations that need that change and creating opportunities for them to work together to actually create the changes that we need to see.

Missy Mastel (06:39):

I call it “sustain exchange” because it really is, well, Hinge for corporations and nonprofits and impact investors who are interested in building the adaptations that we need to see in the world.

Stephanie McCullough (06:57):

Ooh, there’s so much there.

Missy Mastel (07:00):

The best way to think about it is if you look at the way … if you look at what’s going on on the planet, if you think about how people are acquiring wealth right now, this (hypergrowth capitalism), there’s no end that they’re looking at.

Missy Mastel (07:16):

I’ve talked to maybe 500 CEOs, and all of them say, “I need to make more money so I can make a difference.” But they’re not really focused on what that difference is or how much money is enough.

Missy Mastel (07:31):

They’re not asking themselves the big question: “What does it mean to make a difference? What does it mean to have enough?” And one of the things that we get really lost in the way the current capitalist system works is that we don’t have an idea of what enough is. It’s just more.

Missy Mastel (07:54):

Q3 over Q2. Or next year’s returns better than last year’s returns. And that’s exhausting. Absolutely. And what I really love about people who are taking on investing and retirement planning now (and women and nonprofits) is we can ask a better question.

Missy Mastel (08:20):

We can say things to ourselves like, “Hey, what do I really want to change here? Is water my issue? Is the global south something I want to make a difference in? Do I want to affect my community? What’s important?”

 

 

Missy Mastel (08:38):

And more importantly than just what’s important in a global, “What’s important to me and what’s important to the people that I care about and I love?” We think about this idea about having enough money to build these beautiful mansions on these beautiful hills.

Missy Mastel (08:55):

But if the world is burning around us, that mansion is a prison. We have to have balance. So, we’re talking to it — so, what I like to think and what I’d like to introduce right now, maybe, is this idea of women as impact investors.

Missy Mastel (09:13):

And I will say they are the best impact investors there are. They are people who understand what a collective community can do. The power of being in community, being together and doing things together, and the power of the individual to spark the right flames.

Stephanie McCullough (09:32):

So, I want to pick up on a couple of things you said. One is the idea that people who have been financially overlooked have more power than they think. And then the pushing back on, “Oh, I have to have all this wealth so I can make a difference.”

Stephanie McCullough (09:47):

So, are you saying that someone who maybe doesn’t consider themselves “wealthy” per se, because “wealthy” always seems like, “Oh, it’s more than what I have.” Whatever level you might have.

Stephanie McCullough (09:58):

A lot of my clients don’t think “wealthy” refers to them. But are you saying that those people can make a difference even if they don’t feel like they’re wealthy?

Missy Mastel (10:10):

Absolutely. And there’s so many good ways, and they can do it without spending a dollar of their own money. So, one of the ways that we talk to impact investors is that they have to be asking the right questions.

Missy Mastel (10:25):

And asking the right questions … I don’t know if you know this, but women say 21,000 words a day. Men only say on average, 7,000.

Stephanie McCullough (10:35):

What?

Missy Mastel (10:36):

I know. It’s true. So, if you are talking to other people who are in your circle, whether it’s other women or at your lunch or whatever, use some of those 21,000 words to ask better questions about what you want and what you feel you deserve out of the society that you’re living in. You have so many extra words. You’re so much more comfortable talking.

Missy Mastel (11:06):

So, one of the ways that we create impact in investing is by asking better questions. And you can use all the tools that you’re learning here in the financial planning work that Stephanie and Kevin are doing with you to understand what those questions are.

Missy Mastel (11:21):

And some of those questions are the ones that you’re asking yourselves. “What does this get me? If I give you $500 or if I create an organization, if me and my group of women all invest $500 in your organization, what do I get out of it?”

Missy Mastel (11:41):

And don’t focus so much on the returns. Focus on what that organization’s point B is. You want to align your values. So, you certainly want to be able to get some return. But what you really want to do is be able to say is balance that return out with the impact that you want to have in the world.

Missy Mastel (12:01):

So, you want to be able to tell the corporation and the nonprofit (whoever it is you’re giving your money to), “What is your impact that I am now a part of?”

Kevin Gaines (12:11):

When you were saying that you were talking with people who want to make a difference, but they want to accumulate more first, is part of that they’re thinking they want to do this, but they don’t know what a successful helping of a nonprofit would look like to them, so they have to think.

Kevin Gaines (12:31):

So, they think they need more money because they really haven’t pictured what success — or I don’t want to use the word “success,” but something but a productive contribution looks like.

Missy Mastel (12:44):

Valuation. Contribution, yes. So, the nonprofits that are working in the best, they have an idea of what they may want things to look like, but you’re going to be better suited to ask better questions with the things that you know about what you want to see in the world.

Missy Mastel (13:01):

If you have time to serve on a board or a committee for a nonprofit, you can add more value than just your money. Those opportunities help to drive those nonprofits, and those nonprofits to their best results.

Missy Mastel (13:22):

If they can accurately articulate the things that they want to see in the world, then you’re helping them to be better at raising more money.

Missy Mastel (13:34):

And one of the things that I’m working on, which I think is sort of like a no-brainer, is how corporations can use their money to help nonprofits by creating … is how corporations can help nonprofits use the money that they might invest in them to build more impact in the world.

Missy Mastel (13:57):

And the corporations can take that impact in as part of what they’re doing in the world. So, we have these new — what we are trying to build at these partnerships between the corporations that you’re investing in and the nonprofits that they might work with to build better impact.

Missy Mastel (14:17):

Why do we focus on corporations? Well, because they’re some of the largest resource users in the world. And they’re also creating the most wealth in the world. But as people, we want to see those corporations invest back in a planet that we can live on.

Missy Mastel (14:36):

And I’m a climate girl. That’s just me. Obviously, I support a whole bunch of nonprofits. But right now, I’m really into climate. But there’s a lot of different ways that corporations and nonprofits intersect on their values.

Missy Mastel (14:49):

Climate’s just really easy for me to explain because if a corporation supports a nonprofit who’s building a bicycle coalition, let’s say you have a nonprofit bicycle coalition, and that corporation is supporting that nonprofit, we’re saving on commuting resources. Cars in traffic, all of those things that are annoying and are making our planet less livable.

Missy Mastel (15:16):

So, it’s very easy for corporations to do that. But you as the impact investor, you’re the catalyst, you’re the key. You’re the one that says to the corporation you’re investing in, “What we want to see is not just … we don’t want to see crazy, hypergrowth returns all the time. We want to see you investing in the relationships with nonprofits.”

Missy Mastel (15:41):

And because you’re the impact investor, you can talk to both types of organizations equally. You can tell your corporations that, and you can tell the nonprofits that you’re working with. Another great thing you can do is to ask the nonprofits, “How are they?”

Missy Mastel (15:59):

Every nonprofit, because of what they do, just their mission in life is to create a better planet. If you’re working with a nonprofit whose mission is not to create a better world, then we’ve got a problem.

Missy Mastel (16:14):

But they all have something, some mission that’s on point. Whether it’s environmental or maybe it’s a social good. Maybe it’s creating communities, maybe it’s empowering women, maybe it’s youth and girls and coding; they all have a mission.

Missy Mastel (16:31):

And each of those missions intersects with something the corporations are doing. And as long as you’re interested in it, you can ask those nonprofits to give you impact statements to understand what they want to do in the world.

Missy Mastel (16:51):

And bring that back to the corporation, and say, “We don’t just want you to make better returns, we want you to make returns, but we also want you to take some of those returns and invest it in a world we want to live in, whether it’s in coding or whatever.”

Stephanie McCullough (17:06):

Can we stop for a sec, maybe, and dissect this term, “impact investor?” Because it’s perhaps maybe different than people imagine. They might imagine (I’ll just pull out a name) Melinda Gates being an impact investor because she’s got billions and billions of dollars.

Stephanie McCullough (17:24):

But how could I possibly be an impact investor when I only have whatever, a few hundred thousand dollars in my retirement account?

Missy Mastel (17:31):

Oh, so being an impact investor is about using your brain as much as you use … it’s an equal part, brain and money. So, when you’re investing in a corporation, you’re asking them questions that make them think differently.

Missy Mastel (17:47):

So, an impact investor is an investor who believes in the impact that you have on the world.

Stephanie McCullough (17:54):

Even if my impact is a small dollar amount.

Missy Mastel (17:57):

Especially if your impact is a small dollar amount. Because Melinda Gates, she’s not actually an impact investor, frankly, Stephanie. She’s a philanthropist. So, she’s not really talking to corporations much at all about what they can do.

Missy Mastel (18:19):

But you, as somebody who is looking to invest in corporations that have returns, you’re someone who is interested in the balance. The return, and the impact. That’s what makes you an impact investor, is that you are interested not just in returns, but in a legacy of, again, a planet or a world that you would want your children to grow up in.

Missy Mastel (18:50):

I was sitting talking to the legal head of a major Fortune 500 company the other day. And I said to them — they were on the phone and giving me all these reasons why they had so many shareholders and people lining up to be shareholders and they didn’t need to talk about climate, and they didn’t need to talk about social and governance and they had it all on lockdown.

Missy Mastel (19:12):

And I said to her, I said, “I hear you on what you’re saying, but the fact is, I’m a parent, so I can’t let this conversation go.” And she stopped for a second, and she said, “I’m a parent too.” And it changed the conversation.

Missy Mastel (19:31):

When you’re talking … because no longer … there’s a cognitive dissonance that’s happening between people who go home, and they want to raise their kids, and they want their kids to be nice kids, and they want their kids to have purpose.

Missy Mastel (19:46):

And they want them to be contributing to the planet and what we’re doing in business, which is exactly the opposite. We’re telling our kids crazy things, like, “You have to do better than your parents did.” That’s impossible at this point.

Stephanie McCullough (20:03):

And do better, meaning make more money.

Missy Mastel (20:05):

Financial and make more money, exactly.

Stephanie McCullough (20:06):

That’s what we mean.

Missy Mastel (20:08):

That’s exactly right, Stephanie. Thank you so much. That’s precisely right. We can’t. We can’t ask our kids to do that. We have to ask … because first of all the planet can’t support it and b, it’s an insurmountable task. It’s herculean; they can’t do it.

Missy Mastel (20:22):

The kids today they’re worried about being exploited by corporations. So, if you’re a parent and you’re investing in corporations that aren’t thinking this way, then you’re the catalyst. You’re the one that has to make that change.

Missy Mastel (20:39):

You have to tell the corporations you’re investing in, “These are important. I don’t want to be investing in corporations that are exploiting people for their work.” When a corporation has … you can see the stock market actually changing now ever so often.

Missy Mastel (20:58):

It does work on the pricing and the valuations of these companies, but it’s also working on what these corporations are doing to the planet and what they’re coming out with in their sustainability reports. And how they’re treating their factories in the global South, in the Philippines, and in China and in India.

Missy Mastel (21:16):

So, we’re seeing more and more of it. And as the younger generation, as the stewards — we are the stewards for the younger generation.

Stephanie McCullough (21:25):

Right. Because we won’t be around forever.

Missy Mastel (21:27):

Yeah. Exactly. And so, we have to start training these corporations (because we can) to think differently about what kind of planet we want to live on and be vocal about it.

Kevin Gaines (21:46):

How do you push back (I’m assuming you’re going to push back) on when somebody says, “How am I even going to get a corporation to take my call? I’m just…” Fill in the blank. “How can I make it — I’m too small to make a difference.”

Missy Mastel (22:00):

So, that’s where the non-profits come in. So, for your impact investing, I’m aware that people feel like they’re just like a small cog, and maybe they have a few hundred dollars invested in a corporation or something like that.

Missy Mastel (22:17):

But the first thing (this is kind of a … let’s call it a stepped process) I would do is read their sustainability report. As you’re looking at your investments, check to see, “Are they doing anything you like in the world? Are they aligned with your values?”

Missy Mastel (22:32):

So, that’s the first thing. And if they’re not, you might find a nonprofit that is aligned with those values and might be a good partner. And one thing I can tell you is that Sustain Exchange (which is the company that we’re building right now) does that.

Missy Mastel (22:50):

It looks for nonprofit corporate relationships that make impact sense. So, I’m going to suggest if you’re invested in a corporation and you don’t know a good non-profit that could help them, call me. I can find one for you.

Missy Mastel (23:05):

There is no corporation that can’t be benefited by a non-profit partnership and relationship. And then, I guarantee the non-profit will take your call. And you can start talking to them about what kind of impact they could have on this corporation.

Missy Mastel (23:22):

And then you’re collectively (as we are one want to do), creating impact in that area. Does that make sense?

Kevin Gaines (23:29):

Yes, yes.

Missy Mastel (23:31):

So, you don’t have to go at this alone. That’s the other wonderful thing; is you don’t have to do this impact investing alone. There are a ton of other impact investors who are looking at non-profits and looking at collective investments if you’re in a mutual fund.

Missy Mastel (23:48):

You might find a mutual fund that does impact. And one of their offerings might be an impact investing offering. You could do that. Align yourself with — and then you get to ask a lot of questions of your financial planners.

Missy Mastel (24:02):

Ask them, “Hey, what kind of impact are we having here? Are we reducing child labor work? Are we helping to create more agricultural sustainability?” Here’s the thing about the climate and everything else; we actually know the right thing to do.

Missy Mastel (24:23):

We’re not waiting for the answers on how to build a better world. We have them. We just need to decide to make them a priority. And nothing says more about your priorities than where you put your money and your time.

Stephanie McCullough (24:38):

Okay, now you just mentioned time. And something that you and I just spoke about briefly before we went on the air is, okay, if our listeners are thinking towards “retirement,” whatever that means to them. A next phase of life.

Stephanie McCullough (24:52):

Maybe could be stepping away from a corporate job and not working. Could be just some other type of reinvention. But it’s not only about how you’re going to line up your money, right?

Missy Mastel (25:04):

Yeah, absolutely. And I believe that here’s the thing about your investors and all of the people who are listening. Whatever you’ve done at work, it may have been brilliant and wonderful, but now, you can take all of that learning, all of the things that you’ve learned, and apply it for the good of the next generation and the future.

Missy Mastel (25:29):

And a great place to do that is in nonprofit work. Those people really need to sit — if you worked in legal or finance, you can sit on a nonprofit board; they really need your help. If you worked in market … it doesn’t even matter what you did.

Missy Mastel (25:50):

But I can think of thousands of nonprofit organizations that can use your expertise just as it is. And for whom, even if you … some people even go and work in nonprofits. They become EDs or something like that, also an option.

Missy Mastel (26:07):

To take all of that collective learning, you now can apply it to all the good you want to do in the world. And frankly, when we talk about eulogies, these are the things that people talk about, is those impacts that you’ve had almost after you’ve retired at work.

Stephanie McCullough (26:25):

Yeah, your legacy.

Missy Mastel (26:28):

Exactly. We want your legacy to be something that is meaningful and constructive. And imagine what would happen if each of us just found something meaningful to us and made it the best it could be.

Stephanie McCullough (26:41):

And it’s not just good for the world, it’s good for us as (let’s face it) we’re all aging every day. And staying connected, having something that’s meaningful, feeling like we’re having an impact is important for health and longevity too.

Missy Mastel (26:58):

Exactly. And imagine if you take a lot of people who have felt a little overlooked and a lot of different organizations who have felt a little overlooked, like these nonprofits, just like some investors, they don’t have any idea what their power is.

Missy Mastel (27:14):

The nonprofits don’t have any idea that they’re holding really the quality of the future of our existence, of the whole civilization, in their hands. And you can help them unlock that by asking better questions, by integrating with their purpose and helping them to be better because of all the things that you can ask.

Missy Mastel (27:38):

That’s where … if we want to look at Star Trek Utopia world, that’s what gets us there. A lot of people are talking about things like progress, but AI is not progress. It’s replacement. We’re just — instead of doing one thing one way, we’re doing something another way.

Missy Mastel (28:00):

Progress requires us to look at what point B looks like. And I’m just going to say it again, point B is not you living in a giant mansion while the world burns around you. Progress is where we all have to get progress, means collectively we get someplace together.

Missy Mastel (28:21):

And I love those pictures of the buildings that are all windows with the grass-hyper-environment stuff growing out of them, beautiful, integrated nature with our needs for civilization.

Missy Mastel (28:38):

The arts, communities, all of those things, that’s progress. Not this idea of capitalism to whatever the end point might end up being. So, those are your options. That’s what you can do with retirement, that gives you power to create the world you want to live in, and the world you want to pass on.

Kevin Gaines (29:03):

Missy, I want to go back to something you said in the very beginning, and I don’t remember how you described it, and I apologize, but I wanted to hear more about this. You said in the beginning, you were helping nonprofits figure out how to be (this is my phrasing) more than they think they are, or something to that effect.

Kevin Gaines (29:22):

How did you do that? What are you talking about? Where are the nonprofits not thinking? I want to hear more about this.

Missy Mastel (29:30):

Sure. So, think about who starts nonprofits. Nonprofits are people who start missions. They see a problem in the world, and they want to solve it, and that’s great. And what they will do is they will bring together groups of friends, and they will create an organization that does programmatic work.

Missy Mastel (29:50):

But nonprofits need so much more than just programmatic work, they need to understand finance. They need to understand the legal ramifications of what they do. They need to understand taxes, they need to understand development. They need to understand marketing. But we bring in funds to allow our programs to happen.

Missy Mastel (30:09):

So, it used to be that people would come into nonprofits and donate their time and their money to bring those resources, those capacities into play for a nonprofit on a worthy mission. But people feel strapped these days. They don’t do it as much. So, we need to find other creative ways of building those capacities.

Missy Mastel (30:33):

One of them, and one of the things that I recommend, is when you’re looking at retirement, and when you’re thinking about retirement, that’s an excellent place to help a nonprofit capacity build. You can add those resources, whether, again, you’re some kind of professional.

Missy Mastel (30:48):

So, retirees are great resources for nonprofits because … actually better resources than not because they’re already fully trained in what they do. So, I have one nonprofit, which is really wonderful.

Missy Mastel (31:06):

So, if you think about these people, they take retired doctors, and they put them on the phone with community health clinics in urban and rural environments so that these doctors who are overworked in these incredibly difficult environments have resources of mentors that they can reach out to when they need a diagnosis or they need some assistance in treating something.

Missy Mastel (31:36):

They have doctors on call who have been through it all and seen it all. And these doctors continue to feel like they have an end-of-life existence, making a difference in their world. And it’s not just doctors, that’s just a really easy example.

Missy Mastel (31:53):

Any one of you can do that. The expertise and the life skills that you’ve built over time. But when we talk about — and by doing that and helping the nonprofits understand how much they value.

Missy Mastel (32:11):

When we feel really small, I think one of the most empowering things we can do is remind someone else how important they are. So, if you’re feeling like you’re not making much of an impact or you can’t make much of an impact, go talk to a nonprofit and help them be the best organization that they can be.

Missy Mastel (32:33):

And when they get there, when those nonprofits get to that space, they can then go talk to the corporation and say, “We’re a valuable partner to the things you need to get done in the world. We’re valuable people in terms of helping you create the world that we all want to see. And you’re doing it together and collectively.” So, what’s better than that?

Stephanie McCullough (32:59):

That’s nice. And then let’s face it, ageism is real too. So, even if we might imagine we want to work to a certain age, our employers might not agree. So, I’ve known multiple people who have been out on their years way before they expected to. Finding meaning and a way to contribute in the nonprofit world is an option there too.

Missy Mastel (33:22):

Absolutely. And again, so many interesting opportunities … you obviously could … there’s a lot of different things that you might be interested in. We all sort of had some experience working with nonprofits throughout our lives.

Missy Mastel (33:36):

Communities are basically built by nonprofits, and many communities are nonprofits. So, we all understand how uplifting those things are. COVID made things a little weird because we stopped working in community, but that wasn’t evolution. That was a blip.

Missy Mastel (33:58):

I think a lot of people see that as sort of a post-COVID world, but I don’t believe in a post-COVID world. I believe COVID was a blip, and we have to get back to community. The things we do, we’re always stronger together.

Missy Mastel (34:14):

Just one more thing, when we talk about we’re all in this together, sometimes people can feel lost in those kinds of environments. But the truth is there’s always that feeling that you are striving for. Where your impact (financial, time, resources, your brain) matters.

Missy Mastel (34:38):

And so, don’t forget the relationship between you and the person next to you. When I talk about building a community organization, it’s bigger than two of you. But at the end of the day, you’re still in conversation with another person or another group of people that is important to you. You’re building your community, not just any community.

Stephanie McCullough (35:03):

Right, right. It’s okay to be selfish when you think about that a little bit.

Missy Mastel (35:09):

Exactly right.

Stephanie McCullough (35:10):

Oh, Missy, thank you. We could obviously talk about these things for a long time. Where can people who are interested go to learn more about the work you’re doing or the ideas that you’re sharing?

Missy Mastel (35:22):

Sure. So, thank you so much. I really enjoyed this conversation. What a great way to wake up on a Friday. So, please come out to www.impactnonprofits.co and come see some of the things that we’re doing.

Missy Mastel (35:37):

Particularly if you are already involved with a nonprofit, we have a lot of resources that can help them build better capacities and start their conversations with corporations so that they can get more support.

Missy Mastel (35:51):

Also, you can reach me on my LinkedIn. So, please look me up, Missy S. Mastel on LinkedIn. We do a lot of publishing there on ideas and things that you can bring to the table.

Missy Mastel (36:03):

And don’t ever — I think it was Jane Goodall who said, “Don’t ever underestimate the power of a small group of people to make changes. It’s the only thing that ever works.” I’m paraphrasing, of course.

Missy Mastel (36:15):

But if you are feeling that you are not powerful, you are wrong. You’re very powerful, just in and of yourself. And in community, it’s just multiplied.

Stephanie McCullough (36:29):

Oh, I love that message. What a way to end. Thank you, Missy, for being with us.

Missy Mastel (36:33):

Thank you so much, Stephanie, Kevin, what a pleasure. And thanks again for everything you’re doing for the investing community and for people who really need these resources. It’s important, it’s important work.

[Music playing]

Stephanie McCullough (36:48):

Awesome. We agree.

Kevin Gaines (36:50):

Great.

Stephanie McCullough (36:55):

So, Kevin, Missy is such an interesting person because she brings this nonprofit experience and now to the idea of being an investor and how those two things can go together. The corporate-nonprofit partnership.

Stephanie McCullough (37:10):

But then what I appreciate is like, “What is our role as little individuals here who are not corporate leaders necessarily and not nonprofit leaders?” But what can we do both with our dollars and with our time?

Stephanie McCullough (37:23):

And I love how she was talking about asking better questions. I think when we sometimes feel like, well, “What the heck can I as one person do?” I think I would go back to that idea of asking better questions.

Stephanie McCullough (37:37):

Who can you ask these questions of? How can you use some of your 21,000 words a day to start talking about this stuff? That’s where everything begins.

Kevin Gaines (37:47):

Yeah. Frankly, that’s one of the more intriguing things or interesting things I get out of this podcast. To be selfish. Is talking with people who, when you see the intro sentence to their bio, it’s like, “I don’t know how this is really going to connect with what we’re doing.”

Kevin Gaines (38:09):

But then we have this conversation, and it’s, “Oh, this is how it works for individuals.” We’re not talking — this podcast isn’t built for corporations or for nonprofits or for groups of any sort. We talk to the individuals.

Kevin Gaines (38:28):

But one of the biggest things that we always hear is like, “Well, it’s hard to make an impact if you’re just one person and whatever.” The beauty of talking with people like Missy is she can give us ideas and explain, “This is how you can make a difference.”

Kevin Gaines (38:44):

Not some theoretical, “Well, you could just call up the investor relations department and insist.” It’s like, “No, that BS doesn’t work.” Alright, let’s just be honest. That’s not going to go anywhere.

Kevin Gaines (38:56):

But working the way up (so to speak), talking with the nonprofits, you’re going to have a little bit more leverage with them, and you’re going to give them support in what they’re going to be talking with these corporations. So, that is a realistic way of how to affect change.

Stephanie McCullough (39:18):

And even just showing up at your local community, whether it’s the food bank or some organization that’s working on the cause that’s near and dear to your heart and saying, “Here’s who I am. How can I help?” That’s a big thing.

Stephanie McCullough (39:32):

But then I also like that she pushed back on the misconception of, “Well, I’m not super rich; therefore, my dollars can’t make a difference.” Yes, even as a relatively smaller investor, you can make a difference.

Stephanie McCullough (39:47):

And we will point back to our episodes on sustainable investing, impact investing, socially responsible investing. It has all the different kinds of names. Even just choosing the mutual funds, for example, that are working on issues that are important to you.

Stephanie McCullough (40:04):

I was just reading an impact report of one mutual fund company today of the advocacy efforts they’ve been making and the differences they have made with big companies. Okay, maybe I can’t do it with my couple thousand dollars, but if I’m investing in that fund, I’m giving more weight to their voice when they’re raising the issues.

Stephanie McCullough (40:24):

So, there’s definitely ways that we can all be thinking more strategically about how we’re using our dollars and our time.

Kevin Gaines (40:33):

That’s it. There it is in a nutshell. Finding ways to leverage, not necessarily going straight to the top. But working with these nonprofits, these collective investments, whether it’s a mutual fund or private investments or something like that.

Kevin Gaines (40:54):

There’s different ways you can go about it, so to speak. There’s not one way to climb a mountain. There’s a couple of paths. Some are easier than others, same thing here. There’s different ways to make an impact.

Kevin Gaines (41:05):

Just look for the avenue that works best for you, where you can feel that you’re making the biggest contribution.

Stephanie McCullough (41:15):

Well, and one of the things Missy had told me before was that she feels women are the best impact investors. And I think it’s partly because we do tend to look for ways that we can act as a collective instead of just as one person.

[Music playing]

Stephanie McCullough (41:27):

Dear listeners, we hope you enjoyed our conversation today. We’ll talk to you next time. It’s goodbye from me.

Kevin Gaines (41:33):

And it’s goodbye from her.

Stephanie McCullough (41:36):

Be sure to subscribe to the show, and please share it with your friends. Show notes and more information available at takebackretirement.com. Huge thanks for the original music by the one and only Raymond Loewy through New Math in New York. See you next time.

Voiceover (41:51):

Investment advice offered through Private Advisor Group, LLC, a registered Investment Advisor. Private Advisor Group, American Financial Management Group, and Sofia Financial are separate entities. The opinions voiced in this material are for general information only and are not intended to provide specific advice or recommendations for any individual security. To determine which investments may be appropriate for you, consult your financial advisor prior to investing. This information is not intended to be substitute for individualized tax advice. Please consult your tax advisor regarding your specific situation.